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KAC M110 SASS: The end of the M14 (SR25/ AR10 vs M21 sniper accuracy review)


Welcome back to 9 Hole Reviews, today
we explore the m110 semi-automatic sniper system, or SASS, and pitched
against one of its predecessors, the M21 sniper weapon system In the 1950s Eugene Stoner designed the AR10 with space-age materials and offered it to the US government, and unfortunately for him the M14 was chosen instead the M14 had one
of the shortest service lifes of any US primary service rifles, and non-match
variants were generally known to only have 3 MOA of accuracy… shores of M14
rifles were moth-balled in arsenals until the US recognized a potential in
having a semi-automatic designated marksman rifle… with a significant amount
of money and labor the US was able to accurize these standard M14 rifles into
the M21 and later into the Mk 14 EBR systems the M21s and Mk14s were
used well into the Global War on Terror era and some US units still have them on
hand but the system required re-bedding every 2,000-3,000 rounds
and tended to be more fragile in the field conditions and had major
issues with heat and the point of impact shifts in the 90s Stoner joined the
Knight’s Armament Company on the Floridian coast and set off to further
develop the AR10 into the SR25 system with some initial commercial success… it
was SOCOM who first worked with CRANE to bring in the KAC SR25 in designating
it as the Mk 11 alongside the Mk 12 program With the successful use of their use in
SOCOM in the US Marine Corps the US military said to commission the M110
rifle the SR25 was the AR10 that was
destined to return to the US military’s arsenal and fully eliminated the last
reason for the M14 systems existence as a designated marksman rifle…
semi-automatic rifles are typically more useful in target-rich environments that
designated marksman rifles are frequently deployed in and when shot
from unstable platforms for roles such as aerial marksmen with the SR25 as a
base rifle, Knights used a 20 inch 5R barrel that provides the basis of the
M110’s accuracy, and free floated it under the KAC URX II hand guards, integrated
front sight into it, and backed it with rear 600 meter adjustable sights like
the Mk12, the m110 uses a reflex suppressor that sleeves over the barrel,
but the KAC suppressor cams into a locked collar in front the gas block…
rugged reliability was definitely in mind with the design… as one hinges the
rifle open and removes the bolt the sand cuts on the coated bolt carrier is very
apparent… the bolt is also topped with dual ejectors to ensure positive
extraction and ejection the rifles hammer channel is slimmer than a
standard rifle… we’re unsure this was done to restrict fire control groups to
the KAC match two-stage trigger but the trigger breaks clean and about 4.5lbs
Knights also added an adjustable length stock for shooter
comfort, and manufactured these as fully ambidextrous rifles… fire selectors, bolt
and magazine releases are on both sides of the rifle; finally the entire rifle was
coated in flat dark earth… topped with a Knights 30mm mount and a tan Leupold Mark4 3.5-10x scope with very fast M3 turrets the M110 was
designed around the m118 LR cartridge with a 175 grain long range projectile,
the entire rifle was calibrated for minimal guesswork to get multiple
impacts on different range targets if required so what happens when the M110
takes on the M21? we set up a target sheet and loaded up
some Black Hills 175 grain 308 that closely duplicates velocities
of the M118LR and we have each rifle shoot at four, 9 shot targets, we cook
the barrels with around every 3-5 seconds to simulate a very
target-rich environments… as DMR’s are supposed to handle remember 9 shot
groups, 3-5 seconds per shot and a maximum of 36 shots in four
different groups the results were certainly telling of the two groups first off if we’re only looking for accuracy both rifles do just
fine factoring in some pulls, the M110 wins
out on the accuracy realm of an average of 1.08 MOA with a best
group of a 0.8 MOA 9 shot group The m21 shot an average of 1.83 MOA but in a past review we also clocked it at 0.8
MOA when the groups were shot slowly so, on paper the accuracy was neck-in-neck
the interesting observation was with a point of impact shift by drawing the
center lines of the second to the fourth groupings and comparing it to the
initial grouping center lines we have an average of 1.2 MOA of a point of impact
shipped with the M21 and a very negligible 0.1 MOA point
of impact chef with the M110 by the 13th or the 14th shot, the m21 has been seen to
start shifting groupings to the left and subsequent groupings largely remained on
the left side it is clear that the M110’s light, direct
gas impingement system and free floated barrels is able to ward off some of
these heat-related interferences as a further control,
we compared footage and pull the target from when we shot the M21 a year ago,
when we had a cold range after 8 shots, the cold bore shot placement was
almost a duplicate of our current test we hypothesized that the M21’s heavy
piston system and non-free floated front end started a bind when the barrel
heated up… our results were further supported by reviewing the practical
accuracy results once the M21 passed the 16th round on the practical
accuracy course at the 500-600yard range the barrel was
sufficiently hot and we had significant trouble hitting at 700yards and
800 yards as we chased the rounds this was contrasted with the M110’s performance on a day with some of the most ridiculously high winds… heat
had minimal effect on the M110’s performance to continue with fast
precise follow-up shots… it should also be noted that I had less than 50 rounds
that I’d shot through the rifle when we ran it on the practical accuracy course
and we only had trued our dopes with 2 shots at 500 yards before
shooting the entire course out of 800yards the rifles ability for
relatively unfamiliar shooters to impact targets in a hurry was impressive… now
the M110 is not perfect… the gas tuned M21 had much less recoil but that could also
be remedied with a muzzle brake or the suppressor another issue is at the M110
suppressor gives it a whopping 46.5in or 1.2 meters of a total overall
length when attached, making maneuvering the rifle difficult… at the end the M110
generally replaced many M21 or M14 systems the accurized m14 may be a great
target rifle but oftentimes suitors do not see its flaws with the 2-3
minutes required between shots at shooting matches a designated marksman
rifle ought to be able to handle high-volume shots
without a point of impact shift although the M110 has received success in the
fields the US military has recently decided to start phasing in the newer
H&K g28 rifles designating it as the M110 A1 CSASS or compact semi-automatic
sniper system the German Bundeswehr has been fielding the G28
or HK417 systems since the mid-2000s and has received plenty of feedback on its
accuracy and reliability… this is a truly interesting move back to the piston
design rifle with a shorter barrel and improved maneuverability thank you again
for watching this experiment on the range with two giants of the US
designated marksman rifle world what do you think about the US military’s move
away from the M14 and to the SR25? We’d love to hear from you We’d also like to
thank Chris and Heather from Small Arms Solutions for making this comparison
possible …and until next time we’ll see you on the range

100 thoughts on “KAC M110 SASS: The end of the M14 (SR25/ AR10 vs M21 sniper accuracy review)

  1. The idea of keeping the manual of arms the same is also a great consideration. while someone wouldn't be as precise if they randomly picked it up it wouldn't be much different than picking up an M16 or the like

  2. president excellent rifle powerful weapon great alot of fun shooting there great excited everyshoot perfict fantastic have nice day"

  3. What is the give and take of cost benefit? If you're the government with an open checkbook funded by tax payers, I suppose you can get the KA. But it is nearly 20 times more expensive. That seems ridiculous for the difference to me the average consumer.

  4. As much as I like the M14, I am forced to admit the M110 is a better rifle for it's intended purpose. Can't help but wonder why the M110 wasn't modified to meet the CSASS specifications, and a US supplier.

  5. as much as i appreciate the comparison. Its horribly flawed considering the basic build quality of the M14 is not on par with the SR25/AR10 system. Nor are the prices remotely comparable. This only proves the accuracy is a testament to build quality. The M14's gas system is extremely under designed with 60's cast design compared to machined forged parts of the SR25. That in itself can cause a huge difference in performance. Even still the M14 was capable of making decent groups.

  6. E. Stoner finally gets his revenge against the US Army’s Ordnance Board from beyond the grave. Even the HK uses the same gas system of his AR-18. 😆😅😂🤣

  7. I got to shoot the M110 when I was a medic doing range coverage for our scout platoon. It was pretty cool, I wont lie. I'd love to have one…..but not pay for it.

  8. I own and shoot a box-stock M1A (well, except I replaced the stock with VLTOR furniture just because and like it as well) and LOVE it!
    I've always had a soft spot for the M1A/M14/M21 series of rifles coming, I believe, from my military background.
    But, Boy HOWDY, would I like to own an M110 SASS Variant as shown in this video.
    Maybe one day as it is on my Bucket List, but I'm getting up there in age and have far fewer sunrises ahead of me than behind.
    That's just the sucky part or life.
    If nothing else I'd like to get some trigger time on a couple different variants of DMR's just to say I have.
    Lord knows i have a LOT of trigger time with bolt action rifles and have competed at 1K with my
    .50BMG rifle (didn't do too bad, either, if I say so myalelf) but have also shot beyond 1K with various other platforms, too.
    Oh, well, maybe one day.
    Thanks for the video, Sir.
    I really appreciate your time and efforts in bringing them to us.
    God Bless and Be Safe.
    Overnout

  9. I haven't shot the M14 or any of it's variants but from what I've seen on vids like this one, where actual real life shooters are exploring it's qualities, I think the M14 and variants are still viable however, probably not cost effective to the government. It seems that the M14 and it's brothers need a lot of special attention to get them to M110's baseline performance.

  10. As a civilian , I'm not impressed . These are short range rifles , dime a dozen . At some of those ranges you should get the same result with a .22 with iron sights.

  11. Dude, you did such a great job on this. This is better than a history channel documentary. (although, that isn't saying much anymore) You earned a subscriber.

  12. It would be interesting to see testing of the more modern M14 EBR-RI built for the U.S. Military by Rock Island or built by Fulton Armory w/ a match barrel. Truly the most accurate M-14 systems available. The Rock Island rifle achieves an average of .97 MOA and some tested specimens shoot an incredible .44 MOA @ 100 yards with ball M118LR ammo. The Fulton rifle achieves 0.50-inch three-round groups respectively. Don't know about drifting left issues after heating up

  13. Don't know anything about Raffles or handguns. Have shot some. Enjoy shooting skeet with a shotgun. Love to shoot,the power drivers like in this channel. Love these videos. They are educational, but still Clueless.

  14. Quick question, does a lighter version of the SR25/M110 exist? I want one so damn bad, but the weight is a bit of a turn off for me, espcially with such an outrageous price tag lol.

  15. So, Im learning, but whats the difference (if there are any) between an sr-25 and m110?

  16. both DMRs (M110 or G28) called as 'Gay' on Black Squad game,because they have an insane rate of fire,and bolt action sniper can't beat that

  17. I think they would save a whole shit load of money if they would keep the KAC SR-25s and cut a couple inches of the barrel, adjust the gas system, maybe open the hole up a bit if it isn’t adjustable and bam, you’ve got a KAC G-28. I guess they could care less about money when it isn’t coming from their own pockets

  18. Awesome job guys, but I don't think any of these observations are a surprise. Ar's aren't bedding sensitive, they're light, and the barrel is easy to float. 50+ years of development have made the ar 10 viable platform.

  19. Used the m14 around 2003 it was fine. Used the HK417 in 2016. Obviously my skills greatly improved in that time. But the hk was far better.

  20. I would love to see you guys do a video like this except compare a piston driven AR to a direct impingement system as far as accuracy and POI shift.

    Obviously the accuracy would it be a bit subjective because you won't be able to use the same Barrel on each system. I still feel that the Piston system it's going to affect harmonics but I could be wrong and it would be interesting to see.

  21. This gun is CRAP! If you have ever bought a pie from a Denny's type restaurant, you'll know that the pie comes in a tin foil like plate. Well, that is exactly what this gun feels like it is made from. I had the misfortune to be issued this POS while working in the sand, and let me tell you, it doesn't inspire confidence. If you like this thing then so be it, but I don't want to hear any shit from you chairborne Rangers sitting in your Mom's basement playing medal of honor. Unless your SOTIC certified don't bother trying to debate me.
    And to top it off, if you ever have to deal with Reed Knight of KAC, that just makes it an even bigger POS, as he is one arrogant fuck.

  22. They shoulda used the one stoner started with from square one .. Politics ALWAYS …messing stuff up..556..has it's place but can't beat. 30 cal shoulda stuck with the 30.06 also much more room for what n how your shooting ..i live by the saying ..IF ITS NOT BROKEN IT DOESNT NEED FIXING..JUST MY 2 CENTS

  23. I had the M14-EBR during my time in Afghanistan. You need Allen keys to do the simplest of maintenance 😑

  24. Whichever rifle that gets the job done, is the one that should be used. I will say that most soldiers are going to fell a lot more comfortable with the 110 or a derivative; at least initially. The M14/21 platform is definitely old school and if it's not rugged enough, then that is definitely a clear mark against it.

  25. A "Rifle" . . . ANY RIFLE, is only as good, as the hand the wheels it !. I have a "Match Grade" ( SS Barrel ) M1A, I'll match against ANYONE ! out to 1200 yds . . . as for being a "3" MOA rifle, that is a "Crock a Shit" !.

  26. president excellent rifle powerful weapon great fantastic great alot of fun shooting excited everyshoot perfict fantastic great alot of fun shooting there great is great sniper rifle legend perfict for long range shooting anyway have nice day"

  27. gun people of youtube I call on you! at 4:29 the man walking by with the beard …isn't he Chris Bartochi of small arms solutions channel?

  28. Funny that after all this time the AR10 is making a come back, also when ever you have a shift in hit on target due to heat, its a barrel that's not drilled in perfect center when manufactured.

  29. Mainstream GunTuber Channel Format + Refurbished and Accurized History Channel's Tales of the Gun + Research Papers Visualized and Audio'ed =

    9-Hole Reviews!

  30. Great technical explanation with results clearly defined….conclusions well stated. Dang….you guys are going to drag me out of my old school world. Well done.

  31. I been shooting the DPMS LR 308, 26 inch bull barrel for over 10 years. its a beast to carry, but great for multiple shots. Hands down platform over the M24 just for follow up shots. I'm allowed to take 5 deer where I live. I have put 3 deer down before they get a change to react, fill the freezer and then hunt for a trophy 🙂 could be modified to hunt a trophy bearded Taliban

  32. both are good rifles I had a armalite super sass and an lrb m25 both shot well but the m25 was considerably more accurate so I kept it and sold the sass there is a big difference between an accurized m14-m1a and one purpose built or accuracy like the sass is

  33. Compare the EBR M14 against it. This comparison was not the final generation of M14 therefore not representative of adaptability or accuracy. Yes I am biased. I do think it was high time to go to a modern AR based platform but I also know the M14 EBR in it's many variations is an outstanding platform. Cost of the chassis to upgrade and accurize a long paid for M14, 850 bucks. Maybe not the best solution for long term use but expensive, uh no.
    Thanks for the video I hope you keep them coming.

  34. Oh yeah,,,They put Scope's on them..Make's them MUCH BETTER..I carried a M14,, You would have want ME aiming at YOU!!!!

  35. I'm hopeful once the government adopts the HK and retires the SR25 we'll finally be able to get the SR25 for a decent price point. Because of Government contracts Knight Armament isn't allowed to sell them to us for less than the government pays for one of the rifles. $5k is just to much to shoot .308 out of a AR platform rifle. You can purchase a national match M1A for less then half the cost!

  36. Such an awesome channel!!! Definitely one of the most unbiased, in depth review channels I can find. Keep up the great work guys.

  37. My (2) KA SR 25 20" ECR rifles are among the most accurate gas rifles i have EVER shot! With FGMM 175 or 168 they EASILY print 1 MOA or sub 1 MOA groups with or without the most excellent KA 7.62 qdc suppressor. I also have the KA SR 25 EC and the ECR 16" rifles and while not quite as accurate are close and just an absolute JOY to shoot!!! . KA rifles are on the heavy side which is their downside, however IMHO their accuracy more than makes up for it….. additionally, you are able to withstand EXTENDED STRINGS OF FIRE WHICH Many battle rifles cannot. The HK MR 762 a1 is also an amazingly accurate rifle. What concerns me about that most excellent weapon system is all of the proprietary parts. Having said that, its lighter and is also able to shoot one hole groups. I believe that US MILITARY DOCTRINE is based on the concept that if the target cannot be neutralized within 500 yards then its necessary to utilize air support. The problem I have with this thinking is that what if air support isn't available or is (1) hour away while your fighting for your life?. Having said all of that, I think that the KA SR 25 is an extremely proven and high quality weapons system. I would have GREAT CONFIDENCE going into combat with the KAC SR 25, the HK Mr 762 A1, the LMT 308 or the Scar 17 and Scar 20. All are excellent rifles that are proven performers in combat for militaries and individuals in the United states and around the world……YOU WILL NEVER EVER EVER GO WRONG BUYING A KAC RIFLE……

  38. 3:06 When your girlfriend finds out you've been cheating and throws printed out dms of risky sexts you've been sending your wife of 5 years at you.

  39. Interesting the AR10 going by the wayside so quickly. Performance or politics? After reading a post below it sounds like performance. I come away with this. Give me an acurized battle rifle rather than a rifle you’re trying to make into a battle rifle. Like the Remington bolt hunting rifles used to snipe in Viet Nam. We knew from hunting what worked, was more accurate. But they just issued what we hunted with it it wasn’t battle hardened/designed. Unfortunately things take time. And somethings are proven over time. IMO the M14 has proven itself. Not just we had it and took it out of mothballs cuz its all we had (which it was) but as now proven in comments below it works in battle environs.

  40. Wow, you mean to say a F35 is better than a P35?
    I can't see how modern precision manufacturing, metal plastics/carbon fiber and microscopic analysis could have changed that much since my grandfather won a world war in four years.

  41. It wasn't shot from a ransom rest and there was obvious bias pre-shooting so it's subject to human bias … inaccurate test…I guess it's a good thing no one wins Camp Perry with the M1 (rolling eyes)

  42. NICE rifle as for me use to eat , shit and sleep with my HHR M1A would NOT trust any other rifle in the battle field , thats just me i am old school . Retired USMC . 0311

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